Sales Versus Marketing
(The poor guy on the ground is the customer, by the way) Tom Peters got a bunch of us all riled up with his recent My Shtick post. Here’s the intro:
“I’m on a new campaign. (Old campaign, really, but renewed vigor—and I single it out from the noise.) I am trying to put … SALES … back on the pedestal it deserves. In the process I suppose I’m down-grading marketing—and that’s more than okay per me. Of course I think marketing is incredibly important, but I think it intellectually comes second after sales—and the like of MBA programs have mostly eliminated sales from the picture. Stupid! Hence one of my favorite quotes these days is from Robert Louis Stevenson: ‘Everyone lives by selling something.’”
Well! That got the commenters to typing furiously away. Last count, there are 40 of ‘em. And, I couldn’t resist chiming in, the lone femme among the fellas, since this old sales versus marketing thang is one of my pet peeves. Certainly, as Mr. P quotes, we all sell, and all the time. We just may not realize it. But, we also all “do marketing.”
Two comments really resonated with me:
“The other departments don’t realize that they wouldn’t have jobs if we weren’t out selling.”
Sadly, this type of adversarial thinking is all too prevalent. Somehow, sales is a “dirty” thing to do. I see this problem in particular with scary smart technology start-ups. The founder breaks out in a cold sweat if he/she is expected to “sell” and really thinks they shouldn’t have to.
“Of course no one likes to be sold. Those tactics have been ineffective in sales for decades, and almost no one subscribes to or teaches them anymore. Even your car dealer will now make you sign a statement that you weren’t mistreated when purchasing or leasing a car (maybe not your car dealer, but mine does).
I know you don’t like to be sold, but do you like to have your product or service sold to others? Does your salesforce do so respectfully and honorably? Mine does.”
Key words here: respect and honor.
Me? I advise my clients to send the operations, marketing, engineers and finance folks out on sales calls. Have sales people sit in planning meetings (and be fair to them in taking away selling time on the road.) We’re all in sales. We’re all in marketing. And, yes, nothing happens until something gets sold.
And, a parting shot. I can’t help but wonder - would we have this type “My gun is bigger than yours” and “us versus them” perspective on sales and marketing IF men didn’t (still) dominate the business world? Somehow, I think not. (Don’t get me wrong, men are some of my favorite people. But, my oh my, how they do go on!)
That said, I’ve got to get back to - um - selling and - ahem - marketing.
Tags: blogher, marketing, marketing troubleshooting, nobodies, sales
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May 9th, 2006 at 5:19 pm
Ah semantics. You are right on the money. I also think everyone should also take support calls. Especially the product and sales people. That also opens the eyes.
May 9th, 2006 at 7:45 pm
Mary, here’s my take on the Sales v. Marketing deal. I borrowed these posts from some I made on my site about a year ago.
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Let’s vote: (1) The Marketing Department needs to be more accountable for results: Y or N? (2) The Sales Department needs to be taught the value of branding: Y or N?
The conflict between sales and marketing can be contentious.
Sales: I just need to meet quota. I don’t need all that branding stuff to get in the way. Please tell marketing not to tie my hands by telling me the way I need to talk or write about the product I’m trying to move. I know the business because I’m at the street level. What do they know about what works and what doesn’t? I’m sick and tired of all this branding talk. Just give us the goods to sell and we’ll get the numbers you want.
Marketing: No one likes to be sold to. Sure, that program or B.S. pitch works today but at what future expense? How do you think that cheesy looking PowerPoint or home grown Kinko’s printed brochure reflects on the quality of our brand? Do we really want to be sending a different message for each salesman in the field; their execution is horrible.
The reality is that both are critical. Create brand awareness the way Carl’s Jr. did with the Paris Hilton campaign and fail to follow through with sales programs and you wasted a huge opportunity. Push sales without paying attention to branding and your harvesting, or worse, eroding brand equity.
Marketing makes people want to join the party with the right marketing mix; it sows the seeds of desire. Your sales efforts show them the advantages of a purchase and close the deal. Do both well and you build relationships, or better yet, create advocates for your brand.
Yet Furthermore:
“Getting to Yesâ€, “asking for the order†or other sales closing techniques anger me. I’ll bet the same groups that hire banks of telemarketers also jump to attention when asked, Do they work? “ and cry: Yes, of course they do!
Alternatively, when I think of sales techniques, I think of relationship building techniques. Is manipulation part of that? Get them to say yes often enough and, like a Bugs Bunny comedy bit, they’ll continue saying “Yesâ€, and without realizing it, order a new vacuum cleaner with all the attachments. Or … when you finish addressing concerns, simply assume they are going to place an order and skip to: “where do you want them delivered?†(followed by, “where do I send the bill”).
Let’s dispense with all this crap. We’re all onto it. Feel free to get me excited about your product, answer my concerns (that’s totally cool), offer me a deal, but since I’m your greatest asset, treat me as though I matter for longer than today. You want a relationship with me? Ok then, ask what you must to understand my needs and tell me what it is about your product that fills them. Explain it to me. Make all my other choices disappear by comparison. Make the choice clear. If you offer advice, make it sincere. If - by chance - your product is wrong for me, tell me so and I’ll come back to you like a trusted friend. Manipulate, and you’ll never see me again.
I hate being sold to, but I think I could learn to like salespeople if they stopped using “techniques†that have little to do with me and more to do with sales quotas. Have you ever read: Sales is focused on what’s best for the company and marketing is focused on what is best for the consumer? That’s old school. Let’s start a new school; one in which both sales and marketing are integrated; focus your entire company on whats best for your customer including your “sales techniques”.
To push or to pull - is that the question?
May 10th, 2006 at 8:01 am
Bruce F. I agree! Everyone in the company should have to take support calls. Or at the very least, listen in. Right up to the CEO. Further, part of the marketing department’s compensation/recognition should be directly tied to customer happiness (note I didn’t say “satisfaction”), sales close rates and revenue/profitability growth. It would also help if companies didn’t throw raw new hires into marketing roles. There’s a huge difference between marketing speak/dog & pony shows and holistic marketing focused on customer attraction and loyalty. Reall marketing takes some deep thinking, teamwork (yes, that overworked word), accountability, and, dare I say it? experience.
Bruce D. The dialogue/perspective example is spot on. One thing that I found that helps is to compensate sales people on: 1. profit margin (not gross revenues); 2. same customer sales increase. Of course, the “rape and pillage” Viking sales types won’t last long in such a scenario, and they shouldn’t.
And, in looking at telemarketing and cold calling that “works” My response to those firms would be, “Yes, and how many potential customers did you lose for us?” For every sucker, there are three (or more) savvy customers who don’t want to be sold and hate those cold call interruptions - AND we want to ber respected in the morning, thank you very much.
May 10th, 2006 at 6:09 pm
Douglas Rushkoff speaking at the GEL 2006 conference last week said that the best companies will be those that don’t distinguish between employees, shareholders, and customers - everyone does what they are passionate about. Clearly an ideal situation, but a worthy one to strive for.
On my team, everyone is in it together and we should not waste time arguing about who contributes more - all have a role/responsibility to contribute and all should be able to pitch in and help each other during the crunch periods.
This fits right in with the notion of respect for each other. That goes a long way!
May 11th, 2006 at 6:58 am
Exactly my view Mary. And … don’t get me started on the 24 y/o marketing manager or the 27 y/o agency account supervisor.
I’m having a peaceful morning with my coffee and the dialog would only upset me.